tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8827040061563065922.post5281192811815624333..comments2024-03-29T07:38:17.008-05:00Comments on The Music Salon: Harold Shapero, American ComposerBryan Townsendhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09482696991279345516noreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8827040061563065922.post-45187288074941074782016-07-30T08:13:23.276-05:002016-07-30T08:13:23.276-05:00That seems a plausible theory. There were quite a ...That seems a plausible theory. There were quite a few 20th century composers that were shoved to the side due to the autocratic pronouncements of the ideologues. So, as I said, I will dig out my Shapero CD and have another listen this weekend.Bryan Townsendhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09482696991279345516noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8827040061563065922.post-27992173164486151122016-07-29T15:12:19.717-05:002016-07-29T15:12:19.717-05:00No problem. To add a final note, I maintain that ...No problem. To add a final note, I maintain that the reason Shapero fell into obscurity was not that his music wasn't good but rather that he was a victim of musical fashion. He came to maturity just as the musical winds were changing in the direction of serialism, and while a number of Shapero's colleagues were amenable to these new trends Shapero was apparently not. Michael De Sapiohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03971364262671562750noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8827040061563065922.post-28684713647048960752016-07-29T10:17:44.718-05:002016-07-29T10:17:44.718-05:00Sorry, MIchael, I see you commented previously.Sorry, MIchael, I see you commented previously.Bryan Townsendhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09482696991279345516noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8827040061563065922.post-42981507163844464712016-07-29T10:16:17.689-05:002016-07-29T10:16:17.689-05:00Hi Michael and welcome to the Music Salon. Thanks ...Hi Michael and welcome to the Music Salon. Thanks for contributing! OK, now I have to go and listen to Mr. Shapero again to see if I was off-base in my critique. Actually, I think that the only place Stravinsky might do as you aver would be in one of his less-inspired neo-classical pieces. But I will have another go at Shapero...Bryan Townsendhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09482696991279345516noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8827040061563065922.post-91547837976478678192016-07-28T14:47:43.809-05:002016-07-28T14:47:43.809-05:00"what you might want to do is look at my reas..."what you might want to do is look at my reasons and challenge whether they are appropriate or not."<br /><br />I'll have a go. You say that "Shapero can find no other means to end the piece except by bashing away at the tonic in dreary quarter notes until we get very tired!" But you fail to notice that the tonic notes you refer to are syncopated and that Shapero changes the chord spacing and timbral arrangement of the chords (changing from B flat triads to fifths and ending finally on a unison B flat), much as Stravinsky might do. So as you say, Shapero is writing a rather Beethovenian ending, but in an updated "jazzified" way. Michael De Sapionoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8827040061563065922.post-79436802601440491302016-07-28T08:01:50.145-05:002016-07-28T08:01:50.145-05:00If you are a thorough-going relativist then you be...If you are a thorough-going relativist then you believe that all good or bad statements about art are simply variations on "I like it" or "I don't like it". I am not a relativist, however, so what you might want to do is look at my reasons and challenge whether they are appropriate or not.Bryan Townsendhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09482696991279345516noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8827040061563065922.post-56962197183817902192016-07-27T15:03:40.296-05:002016-07-27T15:03:40.296-05:00Well, disagreement is all part of the game. But it...Well, disagreement is all part of the game. But it´s different to say "he´s not a good composer" than "I don´t like his music" (which is essentially what I got from the article). Those others who did appreciate Shapero disagree with the article, but that´s all besides the point. The important thing is for each to experience for himself. <br /><br />I recently discovered his music and love it: it´s playful, melodic, jumpy, well-crafted, sometimes a modernly quirky revisiting of classical composers like Haydn and others. Along with Irving Fine, Nicolas Flagello, Paul Creston and Walter Piston, he belongs to an extremely creative moment of modern American classical music. B<br /><br />Is he a major composer up there with Barber, Copland and Piston? Can´t answer that, but whether or not he´s major, minor, remembered or forgotten is irrelevant if he grabs my ear.<br /><br />Nevertheless, an informative article.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17023844145167894380noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8827040061563065922.post-56378295796631399322015-06-03T14:06:16.553-05:002015-06-03T14:06:16.553-05:00Hi Michael,
You make a very good argument for Mr....Hi Michael,<br /><br />You make a very good argument for Mr. Shapero and as soon as I get a chance I will have another listen. I just call things as I see them and I don't always see them in a conventional way. For example, I am also NOT a fan of Mahler, which puts me in a minority. But I like challenges and so I will have another listen and get back. And yes, I am a bit familiar with the history of music in the 20th century. Interesting theory as to why Shapero did not achieve a lot of popularity.<br /><br />Later...Bryan Townsendhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09482696991279345516noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8827040061563065922.post-19712619577483269172015-06-03T12:43:59.690-05:002015-06-03T12:43:59.690-05:00Hello Bryan - I find your comments about Shapero&#...Hello Bryan - I find your comments about Shapero's music rather startling. Are you familiar with the American neoclassical school of composers? Shapero epitomized that school, along with Walter Piston, Irving Fine, Arthur Berger, and others. They were all strongly influenced by the rhythmic drive and formal elegance of Stravinsky's neoclassical style, and sought to combine this with a distinctly American sound derived in part from Copland. The Symphony, while not perfect, does an excellent job of updating Beethoven's style for the 20th century just as Prokofiev did for Haydn's style in the Classical Symphony. I'm amazed that you can say that "rhythmically there is just nothing interesting going on." There are syncopations and rhythmic displacements happening on every page of the Symphony. And you say that "most of the movements tend to sound alike"? The slow movement is exquisite, in my opinion, and its poise contrasts well with the rhythmic energy of the fast movements. The reason Shapero sank into obscurity was that his neoclassical style came a bit too late (late 1940s), just as avant garde and serialism were about to come on the scene and sweep more traditionalist styles away.Michael De Sapiohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03971364262671562750noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8827040061563065922.post-47612840160384575302015-01-29T06:49:20.500-06:002015-01-29T06:49:20.500-06:00Oh, and for future reference, condescending argume...Oh, and for future reference, condescending arguments from authority have very little traction here at the Music Salon.Bryan Townsendhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09482696991279345516noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8827040061563065922.post-3764488946850937402015-01-28T06:28:13.908-06:002015-01-28T06:28:13.908-06:00Having a difference of opinion about musical aesth...Having a difference of opinion about musical aesthetics is, on the whole, a good thing, which is why I am unashamed to differ. But I asked for comments and thanks for yours. Would you care to specify a bit about what you mean by the "pure beauty and poetry" of Shapero's music. Maybe I just missed it!Bryan Townsendhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09482696991279345516noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8827040061563065922.post-12402537046381110812015-01-28T03:51:42.340-06:002015-01-28T03:51:42.340-06:00All I can offer in reply to these comments, is my ...All I can offer in reply to these comments, is my sympathy. To be unable to revel in the pure beauty and poetry of this music is sad.<br />I'll choose the opinion of Copland, Bernstein, Fine, Previn, and my own ears, over yours anytime.<br />Best wishes, Brian FerrellSandrahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06260474768318651668noreply@blogger.com